Of subframes, suspensions, torque-steer, and handling...MiniTec?

Started by Tremelune, June 11, 2019, 07:49:29 PM

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Tremelune

I have a 1992 Rover Mini 1.3i from Japan that I am putting a Nissan Leaf drivetrain into (hopefully).

I'm getting close to the point where I'll begin fitting the motor, and I'm trying to figure out how to best set this car up while allowing this to be possible. My goals are pretty much daily driver on bumpy LA roads, with jaunts up in the hills and mountains. Comfort and NVH does matter, but I don't want to lose how fun this thing is to drive around a turn. Hopefully anything will be better than the much-maligned coil springs I have on there now, but I see real value in some kind of adjustable coilover suspension.

I'm not certain what the weight/distribution will be when I'm done, but it will increase by a few hundred pounds and move rearward. Top speed is likely to be 75mph, and highway driving will be rare. Power is about 110 hp, but torque is 210 ftlb at zero mph—quite a bit more than any VTEC motor, which makes me nervous about torque-steer and, well, traction. I don't intend to drag race, but I don't want the car to yank me off the road if I goose the throttle.

Does anyone have experience with the MiniTec front or rear subframes? The fronts are designed to work with Honda D/B engines, and I suspect they'll be better suited to the Leaf motor than the stock subframe (though I have no great reason to believe this). My car is right-hand-drive, which I'd kind of like to keep, though it's not that big a deal to me.

I thought these used Miata coilovers and brake components, but it's looking like it might be specific to MiniTec...? It would be lovely to use standard/common components, if possible. I'd love to get disc brakes on the rear, for no other reason than I hate working on drums.

Are there any other aftermarket subframes (front or rear) that might be worth looking into?


MiniDave

I have a lot of experience with MiniTec subframes, and I think it would be a good choice for what you're doing, I assume you're going to stay front drive, and the battery will go in the boot or rear seat area? The advantage of using the MiniTec subframe is you get coilovers, just as you said, however their subframe may not work with RHD, you'd need to call them on that.

John McGee of McGee Custom Minis does a Honda D series frame that will accept RHD just as an alternative, and his frame is well built but his is designed to use the stock Mini suspension.

All that said, you will wind up modifying it considerably to fit the electrics in, why not just build your own subby?

How cheaply can you buy a Leaf these days and get one with a good battery? Cause I heard their battery lost rechargability pretty quickly, only able to be charged to half or 2/3 after a year or so?

I don't know how the drive is set up on the Leaf, but equal length drive shafts and a good, correct alignment should keep the TS at bay, but no question it could get out of hand, especially from a dead stop....wonder if you could make it rear drive instead?

Please do keep up posted on your progress, we'll be glad to help - and Welcome to the Forum!
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

MPlayle

You might consult with these folks: EV West

They did an electric conversion of a Moke some time back.


MiniDave

Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

Tremelune

I'm in touch with EV West, but they charge six digits for complete conversions, and they have a 4-5 year waiting list (which makes me want to start my own conversion business, but I digress). For the purpose of getting the motor in, I'm hoping any good race shop can fab up motor mounts for almost any subframe in a good spot to keep the half shafts at the same length/angle.

I did not know about MCM! The stock Mini subframe/suspension is good, but I fear the options out there for them might not work well with a strangely-weighted Mini. I plan to put the batteries right behind the front seats, but it's still much closer to the rear axle than the front. I figure with coilovers, I can pretty much have them sprung and valved to suit any configuration (though this may not be true, depending on what shocks are available for the MiniTec subframe. I might not be able to make a great decision until I start weighing the corners of this car as stock and with the ICE components removed.

With regard to RWD, it's a consideration, and there is more than one approach. I think it would take a lot of work to the chassis and the MiniTec RAV4 rear subframe to make it work, and none of it is work I'm capable of doing—same with fabbing up mounts or a subframe of my own. It's either that, or I'd have to keep a (RAV4) transmission and driveshaft in the car (for a AWD), and I'm hoping for a single gear setup.


It's pretty easy to pick up a Leaf for $5-6k these days, but you will want one built after March 2013 to avoid the troublesome battery packs that you mentioned. In terms of swap components, a Leaf nets you 110hp/210tq 10k rpm liquid-cooled motor, an 8:1 reduction gear, a 24kWH battery pack, as well as fast/good charging/BMS. Possibly HVAC as well, but that's a bit of a question mark...It can be a pain to get it all working, though, and you need to keep a lot of crap around. My work in progress on this front is here:

https://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=199847

MiniDave

Right on all counts.....if you watch the vid, even at 30 mph he could squeal the tires just by stepping on it, and that seems like a much smaller motor/power package that what you're thinking of doing.....so I would def think about doing it rear wheel drive.

There is a thread on TMF of a guy from LA who has his electric up and running, I'll see if I can find it.

Found a few actually.....you may already know of these - if so, disregard

http://elkoja.blogspot.com/

http://www.theminiforum.co.uk/forums/topic/225701-electric-mini-early-planning-phase-comments-welcome/?hl=+electric%20+mini

http://www.evalbum.com/1454

https://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/grant-electric-mini-71039.html?&highlight=grant+electric+mini

http://www.bdrive.ch/

https://evmini.ca/post/955438887/the-adapter-plate-fits-my-transmission-honda

Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

BruceK

Welcome Tremelune!   Can't wait to see more as you develop this project.
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
1992 Toyota LiteAce (JDM)
1997 Jeep Wrangler Sahara

Tremelune

I'm still on this, and having a tough time modifying the stock subframe, so I'm still looking at aftermarket stuff.

I haven't read great things about the handling on aftermarket subframes, so I'd like to stay as close to stock as possible there.

Allspeed uses proprietary(?) rose-joint lower arms on its subframe, and it'll cost about $1,500-2,000 to get one to Los Angeles with a wait of almost 2 months. The MiniTec subframe increases track by 1/2" and uses proprietary suspension stuff. Watson subframe also pushes the wheels out.

I'm in touch with John McGee, but his website is literally Facebook, and there isn't much info on these subframes. Does anyone know of a completed conversion with one? What suspension components are used? Are any body modifications necessary?


MiniDave

John's subframe uses the original Mini suspension components, but does move the wheels out -  I can't say how much. The MiniTec uses their own proprietary suspension parts.

I think John's requires very little in body mods, you do have to remove the front parts of the inner fenders but little else, same with MiniTecs but that's only for gas motors for clearance for the radiator and such
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

Tremelune

Does that mean the lower A-arms (or whatever they're called) aren't Mini stuff...?

I guess I'm more concerned with the large offset wheels that the MiniTec subframe seems to need...The increased scrub radius is pretty unfortunate on a FWD car.

MiniDave

John's uses stock Mini a arms etc, I think the mounting points are just moved out slightly. You can buy aftermarket suspension parts that are fully adjustable to allow you to achieve pretty much any suspension set up you need, all in the stock Mini locations. You can also buy coil overs so you can adjust for the weight by changing spring rates.....not horrible expensive stuff.

I prefer MiniSports' adjustable lower control arms and tie bars, they're well made and very strong. For coil overs there are lots of choices thru MiniSpares or Huddersfield...I bought their ProTech coilovers. aluminum bodies for lightness and well made
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

drmini

I just saw this thread and it looks to be an interesting build.  There's one issue that you might want to consider before you get too far into it though.  I don't know if you know it but you won't be able to register a 92 Mini in good ol' California.  I'd hate for you to dump a lot of time and money into a project that you won't be able to drive, especially in the LA area.  Might want to get a much older Mini for your project.  Just a thought.

MPlayle

I think with the EV conversion, it becomes smog exempt and thus bypasses the registration issues in California.


MiniDave

Michael's right, there are at least two running around LA that I know of, both newer cars - 90's era.
Complete failure at retirement

1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
2014 Audi Allroad

jeff10049

I like the idea of using a leaf drivetrain. Great way to get all the major components cheap.
That and the leaf is ugly as hell so no need to worry about gutting one.
I have considered the approach myself for a morris minor.
So the leaf after march 2013 has a better battery pack thats good to know.
Cool project 77.gif


Tremelune

Wait, you know of EV Minis running around LA?? I'd love to be put in touch if possible...I still have a lot of unknowns in my build, as I'm kinda paving the way (at least as far as publicly available knowledge is concerned...