Author Topic: My 65 Australian MKI  (Read 18917 times)

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2017, 12:34:14 PM »
Anyone have any tips when working with the MK1 subframe tower bolts?

Some months ago at a Cars and Coffee Bruce pointed out that mine were missing.  I now have the bolts, insulators, and lock tabs.  I've seen a picture for the order they go on. 

Bruce, think this will be similar to when we changed yours to the urethane bushings?


I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline 94touring

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2017, 12:37:52 PM »
No tower bolts!  Lucky the subframe didn't rip off the car hitting a bad hole.  Nothing special about installing them.  The tabs are meant to be bent over on the bolt heads after you torque them down.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2017, 01:25:43 PM »
What tabs?
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline 94touring

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2017, 01:37:34 PM »
Part #5 has a tab on it that presses up against the tower bolt head. At least one's I've used have them.  I suspect to keep them from backing off.

Offline 94touring

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #29 on: April 08, 2017, 01:48:47 PM »
Part # 21A1470. It's a locktab.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #30 on: April 08, 2017, 01:49:01 PM »
OK, those are on two bolt subframes - I was thinking his were singles because he referenced Bruce's car - which is an
'88....I forgot he has a Mk1

Why does bolt #3 have the necked down area?
« Last Edit: April 08, 2017, 01:53:11 PM by MiniDave »
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #31 on: April 08, 2017, 04:15:12 PM »
Ok, yea, I hadn't driven it a whole lot since I found out.  The reference to Bruces was the process to get the spacer and the lock tab in.

Do the insulator and locktab go on top of the body?  Or does something actually go between the subframe and body?
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline MPlayle

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2017, 04:46:19 PM »
The insulator (Part #4 in the diagram) goes between the body and the subframe.  The locktab (Part #5) goes on top of the body cross-member.


Offline BruceK

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #33 on: April 08, 2017, 07:51:36 PM »
Mark, should be very much the same as doing it on my Mk. V car, except of course for the differences for a Mk. I.   We found out you can do it without having to unhook everything.  Let me know if you'd like some help.
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
2007 Triumph Bonneville

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2017, 03:28:34 PM »
The insulator (Part #4 in the diagram) goes between the body and the subframe.  The locktab (Part #5) goes on top of the body cross-member.

Thanks, that is what I was thinking after reading the reply from 94touring. 

Bruce, Hopefully this week I'll have some time to look at it further.  You loosened your engine stays correct? Or did they have enough flex.  These insulators are flat and only about an 1/8 inch thick.  Think most of the fun will be lining up all 4 holes.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline BruceK

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #35 on: April 09, 2017, 08:06:58 PM »
The insulator (Part #4 in the diagram) goes between the body and the subframe.  The locktab (Part #5) goes on top of the body cross-member.

Thanks, that is what I was thinking after reading the reply from 94touring. 

Bruce, Hopefully this week I'll have some time to look at it further.  You loosened your engine stays correct? Or did they have enough flex.  These insulators are flat and only about an 1/8 inch thick.  Think most of the fun will be lining up all 4 holes.

We loosened the rear subframe-to-toeboard mounts, removed the subframe tower bolts, left the front rubberized teardrop mounts untouched (solid your car) and lifted the body up slightly at the toeboards, letting gravity pull the subframe down the inch or so that was needed.   We did not touch the engine steady(s).   Should be similar on your car except it will likely be necessary to loosen/remove the front subframe mounts since there is no flexibility there like on later Minis.   The other concern on a Mk. I is the hard brake line down to the hydraulic brake switch mounted on the subframe itself - need to make sure that is not stressed.
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
2007 Triumph Bonneville

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #36 on: April 14, 2017, 03:20:11 PM »
Tower bolt installation attempted and failed.  The left side didn't want to line up at all not to mention it's buried behind the radiator.  So I tried the right side.  Looked like it lined up well, but the bolt wouldn't thread in. No problem lifting the body up just like Bruce and I did on his.  Is it possible I have the hydro subframes?  Is there a tell tale way to see this by looking at the subframe?
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #37 on: April 14, 2017, 03:28:57 PM »
Ok, may have answered my own question.  Looking at the diagram above and the top of the tower for the dry vs. hydro there are different sized holes between where the bolts go.  The hydro hole is much larger, and the hole on my towers is very large.  So guessing I got the wrong bolts. 

Both minispares and minisport state it is a 5/16" UNF bolt with length of 4 3/8"  Is this something I may be able to find at a hardware store?  Googled UNF and it says its the fine thread pattern. 
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #38 on: April 14, 2017, 03:34:29 PM »
I doubt you can find 4 3/8, but you should be able to find 4 1/2 no problem, just put an extra flat washer under the head of the bolt. UNF is standard US fine thread, so hardware stores will have them, but I'd recommend you buy grade 8 bolts if you can.
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #39 on: April 14, 2017, 04:12:41 PM »
Thanks Dave, was thinking the same thing with the washer and grade8.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #40 on: April 14, 2017, 04:20:05 PM »
I don't understand what you meant about being buried behind the radiator, the bolts are actually on the other side of the short bulkhead stiffener, well back from the radiator. You should be able to see them easily - I'd recommend you remove the hood (bonnet) for better access.

You can use a long drift to line them up and install one, then the other one should go right in.
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline BruceK

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #41 on: April 14, 2017, 06:14:50 PM »
Mark, are you familiar with Elliot's Hardware in Plano?  They have a super extensive selection of nuts and bolts and may have oddball sizes. 
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
2007 Triumph Bonneville

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #42 on: April 14, 2017, 08:46:49 PM »
Sorry Dave, what I meant was the view of the gap between the subframe and the body where the bolts go in, I couldn't see that area very well because of the radiator. 

Bruce, that's exactly where I went.  No 4 3/8" but got some 4 1/2" and a couple extra washers.  Also got new bolts for the floor to subframe mounts as I'm pretty positive 2 of the ones on there now are original. 
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #43 on: April 22, 2017, 11:54:06 AM »
Ok, so with a lot of effort to get them lined up and through the washers, tabs and spacers they are all 4 in.  The floor board bolts are also back in.  Now a new problem.  With the spacers in place between the body and subframe the bolt holes on the front of the car wont line up.  The ones you guys use for flat towing, mine had tow eye bolts.  Of course looking at the whole set up this makes sense.  With those spacers in how is the front of the body supposed to line up with the subframe since it is now higher at the tower?

Are the spacers not for everycar?  I now know mine had the hydro suspension originally, did it use the spacers?  I only ask because the hole in the middle of the spacer is small like the hole in the picture of the dry subframe.  The hydro subframe has a large hole in it.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #44 on: April 22, 2017, 12:14:27 PM »
Are you talking about the spacers at the front of the car or the ones between the towers and the subframe?

My understanding of the tower "spacers" is that they're really just a vibration damper and the tower should draw up tight to the body, so the alignment of the front holes shouldn't change.

You only use the front spacers to make up a gap between the subframe and the body, so not every car needs them so those shims should not affect the alignment of the holes to the body.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2017, 12:18:24 PM by MiniDave »
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #45 on: April 22, 2017, 12:31:07 PM »
The spacers I'm referring to are the tower ones (see diagram at the top of the page).  The one's I got are solid metal so no give.  That's why I'm wondering if a wet suspension car had them or not because the large hole is not in the center of them.  Of course this also then brings up the length of the bolt.  If I take the spacer out the 4 3/8" bolts look like they'd be to long.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #46 on: April 22, 2017, 12:35:37 PM »
Does this look right?  Other than being sideways.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline MiniDave

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #47 on: April 22, 2017, 12:40:17 PM »
Seems correct to me, how far out are the front bolt holes? Using your theory they should only be out the thickness of the shim, or about 1/8"....that shouldn't really be a problem.

Maybe loosen everything up, install the front bolts, then tighten everything?

I can't answer about using a shim on hydro vs dry, maybe Dan can?

I'll have a very original, unmolested or modified Cooper S hydro car on the rack tomorrow, I'll take a good hard look at this
1989 Cooper Racing Green
2009 Clubman S
1969 Jaguar XK-E FHC
2004 Audi Allroad 2.7 TT

Offline gr8kornholio

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #48 on: April 22, 2017, 01:04:49 PM »
I cant even see the front bolt holes.  And when I jack up the car by the subframe they don't get any closer.  I'll try loosening the floor bolts and see if that gets me anywhere.

Ok, thanks Dave.
I am the GR8KORNHOLIO! Are you threatening me?

Saussie Aussie 1965 Australian MK1 Mini.
"Beavis" - 07 MY/MY MCS, B/MY Konig Daylites, JCW sideskirts, TSW springs, TSW lower rear control arms -- Exploring the country with new friends since 11/09.

Offline BruceK

Re: My 65 Australian MKI
« Reply #49 on: April 22, 2017, 05:05:34 PM »
This sounds just like the problem I have on my car lining up the front subframe mounts.   But I think some of the bodywork on my car was perhaps installed a bit off?
1988 Austin Mini
2002 MINI Cooper S
2007 Triumph Bonneville